Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)
You are Unregistered, please register to gain Full access.    
Advertisements


Reply
Thread Tools
Old 05-15-2014, 01:18 PM   #1
Chaotix
Savage Mad Cunt
Chaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MC
Chaotix's Avatar
Vancouver
Posts: 1,174
MC Status: 752450
Thanks: 20
Thanked 21 Times in 20 Posts
Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

So i've heard from a few glitch-hop artists vespers and ill.gates to name a couple, that they try to write the song as quick as possible.

Basically they do all their sound design first, then they try to come up with a rough plan of the whole song... in a day. Then they do all the fine details and mixing.

Who else does this? and could explain a bit on it. It takes me forever to bounce out a bunch of different bass modulations/Sounds, then to play around with stretching, chopping to make it all fit into a coherent piece.

Are any of you super speedy at this? and what helps your process (Speed wise)

Advertisements


------------------
Chaotix is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 01:29 PM   #2
relic
IDMf Supporter
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 16,048
MC Status: 8492630
Thanks: 9,324
Thanked 6,034 Times in 4,333 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

I agree with this. I dont have a special process, but the more of the arrangement I get done in one sitting the better. Or else I loose the vibe of what got me working on the track in the first place.

Organizing and knowing your sample library well, get it down to the essentials. At this point I dont have to dig very far most of the time to find the sounds I need.

Save and use your own pre sets. In glitch hop for example build yourself some "tool kit" patches to get all those glitch type synths, save your FX chain as presets in your DAW. You are probably just repeating a typical process anyway right?

I also will often use the key/chord "cheats" in the FL piano roll.

Personally I also like using Maschine standalone to start projects as it presents itself as an instrument rather than a mixing enivorment. For me the DAW feels like "mix and finalize" Maschine and my other hardware feels like "create".
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 01:39 PM   #3
Automageddon
IDMf ArtistModerator
Automageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MCAutomageddon is a savage MC
Automageddon's Avatar
Less kids, more synths.
Age: 38
Posts: 9,340
MC Status: 269440008
Thanks: 905
Thanked 2,328 Times in 1,597 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Same.
I spend some time creating lots of loops and sample them in Live.
Once I believe I have enough materials, I start from the intro and build the song in arrangement view, but I try to do as much as I can in a sitting or at least I make sure I finished the part I'm working on.
Otherwise I'll end up with a very nice, layered loop.

This is part of the reason why I use hardware, it forces me to commit to audio so I can free the synth or a part for something else.

------------------
Automageddon is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Automageddon
relic (05-15-2014)
Old 05-15-2014, 01:41 PM   #4
Psychotronic
Digital Surfer
Psychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MC
Psychotronic's Avatar
Posts: 561
MC Status: 18197
Thanks: 42
Thanked 118 Times in 85 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Works for me that way, but i dont arrange, i just play and record. The other thing is, the sound design for a track can take months, especially to make the material playable and interessting. Just a loop is not enough.

------------------
\(シ)/ Soundcloud | Twitch
Psychotronic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 01:42 PM   #5
Psychotronic
Digital Surfer
Psychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MCPsychotronic is a savage MC
Psychotronic's Avatar
Posts: 561
MC Status: 18197
Thanks: 42
Thanked 118 Times in 85 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Automageddon View Post
This is part of the reason why I use hardware, it forces me to commit to audio so I can free the synth or a part for something else.
Agreed.

------------------
\(シ)/ Soundcloud | Twitch
Psychotronic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 07:53 PM   #6
chasedobson
bulletunderabloodredsky
chasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MCchasedobson is a savage MC
chasedobson's Avatar
Denver, CO
Posts: 2,984
MC Status: 1523077
Thanks: 915
Thanked 1,697 Times in 1,110 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

i relate.

some of my best material is the stuff that happens quickly. otherwise i edit to death, overthink to death etc.

------------------
chasedobson is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 10:55 PM   #7
airwalker
Minor Glitch
airwalker will become famous soon enough
airwalker's Avatar
Posts: 40
MC Status: 90
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

yeah i like to lay down the idea asap otherwise i loose my way but i also got into the trap of banging shit out and that was it no mixing at all
airwalker is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Currently Listening To: deptford goth
Old 05-15-2014, 11:13 PM   #8
Numerical
IDMf Artist
Numerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MCNumerical is a savage MC
Numerical's Avatar
Austin
Age: 39
Posts: 10,500
MC Status: 45926631
Thanks: 6,316
Thanked 5,369 Times in 3,410 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Can't. I am mentally and physically unable to create an entire song in one day. Don't know that I'd want to. Glad you guys can, and I'm not trying to sound like I's better'n you, but somethingsomething quality over quantity. That sounds like I's saying I's better'n you even though I was trying not to. Well I's not since my tunes don't come out any better'n yours. It's just that my own standard would go way down if I pumped out a tune that fast. It's almost like I have to preen and sweat over what goes next for it to be any good.

Whew, unpainted my way out of that corner.
Numerical is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Numerical
Nystagmus (07-15-2015)
Old 05-15-2014, 11:47 PM   #9
Drawing Blanks
Learning The Ropes
Drawing Blanks will become famous soon enough
Edinburgh
Posts: 9
MC Status: 60
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

I also feel my best pieces are those that come out of their shell in shorter times than others - but can't know if that's because of the way you perceive something after hearing it so many times, versus the actual quality.

These days I realise I don't have to try and make 6 minutes of something that sounds great to have a good track, just zoning in on the main section and pulling that off in one session gives all the building blocks I need.

Sadly - it seems when I take a break before that point, after initial sound design .. That track is never complete.
Drawing Blanks is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 11:54 PM   #10
sondericker
sondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MC
sondericker's Avatar
Colorado Springs
Age: 51
Posts: 227
MC Status: 1924635
Thanks: 83
Thanked 20 Times in 18 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

I very often begin and finish a tune in one day. It has a lot to do with my propensity to want to explore an idea, hopefully have a few unique creative moments, learn something and then move on. I don't typically work on my beats as much as I should and my sound design efforts vary depending on if that is what I'm interested in working on atm.

I think much of my approach comes from my early years of playing in garage bands where we'd write a song and record it before we were all bored of it. I feel the same way about my electronic compositions. I'd sit and tweak little details if I was releasing an album, but for now composing as much material as possible is what is furthering the quality of my productions.

Short of mashing up some loops, which I have no interest in, I'm sure my approach to composition doesn't produce polished and professional sounding tracks that are catered to a particular genre. I'm totally cool with that being the case. I just like to jam, the technology and the endlessness that it is as a creative outlet.

-Soundwrecker

------------------
http://www.soundcloud.com/soundwrecker
Live 9 Suite, Alchemy, MAX/MSP, Komplete 8 Ultimate,
Iris, Ozone 5 Adv, Nectar 2, Alloy 2, APC40
Ableton Push, NI Audio 6, Shure SM48, Yamaha HS8s
sondericker is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2014, 11:59 PM   #11
sondericker
sondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MCsondericker is a savage MC
sondericker's Avatar
Colorado Springs
Age: 51
Posts: 227
MC Status: 1924635
Thanks: 83
Thanked 20 Times in 18 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

I also believe that we all experience "moments of illumination" in which we are at our creative peaks. Some artists have rituals to try to cultivate this ability, or at a minimum increase the frequency that it occurs.

I know waaay back in the 80s the band "They Might Be Giants" had a manager who made them compose one song per day. They'd put it on their answering machine message and fans could comment. "Dial-a-Song... free when you call from work!"

I think the exercise is a useful one in cultivating all of our ability to slip into exceptional moments, and at a minimum you end up with a big pool from which you can pick to develop something good.

------------------
http://www.soundcloud.com/soundwrecker
Live 9 Suite, Alchemy, MAX/MSP, Komplete 8 Ultimate,
Iris, Ozone 5 Adv, Nectar 2, Alloy 2, APC40
Ableton Push, NI Audio 6, Shure SM48, Yamaha HS8s
sondericker is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2014, 01:38 AM   #12
StephenCozzone
Knob Twiddler
StephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to beholdStephenCozzone is a splendid one to behold
StephenCozzone's Avatar
Posts: 239
MC Status: 810
Thanks: 31
Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

I usually take a couple of days just to sleep on an idea and explore some other options. I know that Deorro made yee in 45 minutes and hard we'll made spaceman in a half hour.
StephenCozzone is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2014, 05:57 AM   #13
Evoava
Sample Destroyer
Evoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond reputeEvoava has a reputation beyond repute
Posts: 295
MC Status: 2110
Thanks: 42
Thanked 42 Times in 33 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Hmm. I've been thinking about this lately as well. I've recently thought up a fairly linear workflow to achieve what you're talking about, where i can just translate what's in my head ONTO midi. It taken some time for me to actually think it out, since I had to become familiar with it all.

For example, I'll just use a drum machine for the drums ( I have like 10 of them, Microtonic being my favorite! (also have an 808 ), A chosen synth, such as Sylenth, I get samples as I go. I cheat and use FL's arp, which I'll then turn into midi so I can mess around with it, combining that with actual melodies in my head. I'll then just binge arrange without stopping. I can usually shell out a decent 1-2 minutes of material this way before I lose steam. So this particular workflow is a 2 day deal, which I'm happy with. Hopefully I'll just get faster as I go.

I feel like this way I'll get lots of practice putting music together, instead of working on a single track a whole week or something. If my track shows potential though, I'll let it sit so I can spend much more time fleshing it out later.

OH yeah. The reason I decided to do this was because I had read an interview with Luke Vibert where he stated he had over a thousand 'skeletal' tracks, or just bare bone essentials. What he'll do is make it, come back and listen through it later to see if it has potential to become something more. I did some math and realized at my current rate, it would take me over a decade to get to just one thousand tracks since I was so meticulous about my music. I figured something needed to change.

Last edited by Evoava; 05-16-2014 at 06:03 AM..

------------------
Some IDM for the IDM forum


Me Soundclewd
Evoava is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2014, 06:59 AM   #14
edium
Sample Destroyer
edium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to behold
Posts: 284
MC Status: 760
Thanks: 15
Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Yeah dude! 100% I tend to do this, but its usually not a conscious decision that I make. So I spend a vast majority of my time in sound design making synths that I know I'll use, and I mess with midi or rhythms and enhance/tweak my synths as I go you know

So basically at some point i'll hit an idea that I really like (i dont deal with anything that i am unsure about anymore i'll sit on the 'keepers' until something works. But once i get that something working it kind of tells me how a large portion of my arrangement will sound like so I really get most of the idea on paper in that sitting. Like i wont have everything timed out perfectly most of the time, but the general feel of what I want it to sound like will get finished. It feels more natural to work this way too, but if you need to force yourself to work this fast I don't know if i'd recommend that.. I do remember hearing a lot of artists say that they made their best tracks in short periods of time though.

------------------
please subscribe if you like my music. cheers!
edium is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2014, 04:05 PM   #15
Chaotix
Savage Mad Cunt
Chaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MCChaotix is a savage MC
Chaotix's Avatar
Vancouver
Posts: 1,174
MC Status: 752450
Thanks: 20
Thanked 21 Times in 20 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Well I'm not exactly talking about banging out the track in a day, as in being completely finished. The sound design before you start the track can take say a week. Then when you have all your sounds, going in and making a rough skeleton of the whole song in a day. Then after the mixing and little fine edits can take two weeks to three. So in all it took a month roughly to make the whole song.. but I'm just talking about the arrangement in a day.

I find it hard because, if i make a skeleton, it usually doesn't sound very good. Which makes me lose interested in the song. I guess it's more of a mental thing I need to get over... I've always been a mix and fine edit as i go type of person... and I find i never finish anything, so a change is needed haha.

------------------
Chaotix is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2014, 02:01 AM   #16
Roland_Abuser
Radial Developer
Roland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to beholdRoland_Abuser is a splendid one to behold
Roland_Abuser's Avatar
Good `Ol Yorkshire
Posts: 138
MC Status: 760
Thanks: 21
Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaotix View Post
I find it hard because, if i make a skeleton, it usually doesn't sound very good. Which makes me lose interested in the song. I guess it's more of a mental thing I need to get over... I've always been a mix and fine edit as i go type of person... and I find i never finish anything, so a change is needed haha.

I completley hear ya there. I usually start with Kick, Snare, Perc to build a groove, an acid line to front up that groove then some hats. Thats my basic skeleton and I can do that in say an hour. Yeah, i need more sounds in there but just before I get to adding them I think (for eg) 'that snare's not snappy enough' so i make it snappy as feck but then the kick and percs dont hit hard enough so they get processed, Then the acid line gets distortion and delay to flesh it out so it now fits and then you cant hear the hats so they get processed.
Then comes adding the other bits n bobs and because of all the processing everything else has gone through it's impossible to work out what sounds right.

I really wish i could gather together a skeleton of sounds that could then be arranged real fast but that shit is hard!
Roland_Abuser is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2014, 09:31 AM   #17
edium
Sample Destroyer
edium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to beholdedium is a splendid one to behold
Posts: 284
MC Status: 760
Thanks: 15
Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

yeah dont use skeleton structures IMO, i have a story kinda related to this..

so i made a song w a buddy of mine, and we dont live close to each other so it was kind of like I make something you add to it and keep sending it back and forth, but he sent me back this thing that had a breakdown and a drop and the thing was just set in terms of structure, how long the breakdown was etc. I could not think of anything creative for a long time, and when i did make something i changed the whole structure of the song in the process (b/c i got frustrated).. I just feel like it confines your creativity by having some set skeleton structure. I think the song should tell you how it should be structured as you figure out what it sounds like if that makes sense

also about the not finishing something, i think you should really try to finish something. I used to be like that, i started w just random loops really and just keep making them. But once i forced myself to finish something I pretty much finish everything that I start now, and any ideas as i worked that I felt like didnt really work or i wasnt convinced about I just ditch b/c ill never be motivated to finish it anyway

------------------
please subscribe if you like my music. cheers!
edium is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2014, 11:57 AM   #18
Praxisaxis
Knob Twiddler
Praxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond reputePraxisaxis has a reputation beyond repute
Posts: 228
MC Status: 5760
Thanks: 33
Thanked 115 Times in 77 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Whatever style of music you make, it's important to have a "sketching" phase. This happens somewhere near the start of the process. It's important, because without a skeleton or rough draft, or large-scale conception, your own "critical reflection" can cause you to give up, and leave a string of uncompleted tunes.

With a good system for sketching - enough of do drive you over a kind of threshold - the critical appraisal and self-discipline which can (and should) follow later don't habitually cause you to leave things unfinished.

------------------
-----------------------------
PRAXIS AXIS
Beatport
Here's a new tune:
Praxisaxis is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Praxisaxis
Lug (05-20-2014)
Old 05-23-2014, 04:07 PM   #19
Audio Geometry
Minor Glitch
Audio Geometry is a jewel in the roughAudio Geometry is a jewel in the roughAudio Geometry is a jewel in the roughAudio Geometry is a jewel in the rough
Audio Geometry's Avatar
Ithaca, NY
Posts: 41
MC Status: 310
Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by relic View Post
I agree with this. I dont have a special process, but the more of the arrangement I get done in one sitting the better. Or else I loose the vibe of what got me working on the track in the first place.
This has been my experience, as well -- with both electronic and classical writing. I've been finding that the pieces I feel are the most successful were the ones that I sketched out (even in really rough outlines) in one or two sittings. Then, once I have a clearer conception of the form and how parts relate to one another, I can go back and shape the details. Otherwise, if I try to start from the beginning and proceed only after a section is *perfect*, my brain gets lost and the ideas seem to fizzle out.

This is just the process that has worked for me; I've seen others have great success with different approaches.
Audio Geometry is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Audio Geometry
relic (05-23-2014)
Old 05-23-2014, 04:41 PM   #20
relic
IDMf Supporter
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 16,048
MC Status: 8492630
Thanks: 9,324
Thanked 6,034 Times in 4,333 Posts
Re: Arranging a song in a day (Not mixing)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio Geometry View Post
This has been my experience, as well -- with both electronic and classical writing. I've been finding that the pieces I feel are the most successful were the ones that I sketched out (even in really rough outlines) in one or two sittings. Then, once I have a clearer conception of the form and how parts relate to one another, I can go back and shape the details. Otherwise, if I try to start from the beginning and proceed only after a section is *perfect*, my brain gets lost and the ideas seem to fizzle out.

This is just the process that has worked for me; I've seen others have great success with different approaches.
It is just the way my brain is wired. I work this way with writing music, poetry, fiction, essays and other creative things. I have to at least get the meat of the idea down, the thing the energy is coming from. The rest I can come back and finish even years later.

Advertisements

relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to relic
Numerical (05-23-2014)
Reply


Thread Tools

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
(Experimental/Dance?) Working on my arranging skills fluent2332 Listening Booth 6 02-24-2014 10:25 PM
Mixing as you make the song? Chaotix The Studio 32 09-27-2013 07:06 AM
anyone interested in mixing/mastering a 4 song EP? (will pay) Marjen The Studio 3 11-19-2012 03:12 PM
Song Arranging? maesojua Music Theory & Composition 7 05-30-2012 12:32 PM
I need help with mastering/mixing down this DnB song EnsoiWhite Listening Booth 1 09-22-2011 11:31 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:03 AM.


Electronic Music Forums

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.